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tony01

GM FUTURAMA

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It would be nice if we could get the exterior 'grade' plotted as an overlay on the middle of these three drawings. Then we could see how much was 'basement' (below grade).

I believe a couple of years ago it was revealed that the high point of the ride- where the exit and entry ramps were located- and the short ride right after the start- was at a level even with the 'windows' on the front of the facade. Which I would take to mean "2nd floor".

And from there it appears that the ride 'dove' all the way down into the basement. There is a picture of the 'grade' on that section of the track on nywf64.com.

On the top drawing, it might be that the elevation of the track is indicated by shading. Black is the highest point, and white is the lowest point in the ride. A 'medium gray' might be at street level.

gm79.jpg

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The WF Guidebook states that demolition requires only going 3 feet below grade, then backfilling and planting grass.

So all the basement walls of GM are still there, intact. They were built with the double purpose of providing a chamber for depositing all the demolition rubble. This was the reason GM was able to dismantle the building so fast, as they didn't have to cart away most of the debris. And even though GM was one of the largest buildings at the fair, it was one of the first to come down, almost doing a disappearing act in as little as four months.

So in essense, the GM building is really all still there!

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If I had to wager on it, I'd bet the fiberglass chairs from the ride are not down there. The mechanical guts of the ride? Maybe....

The biggest "dig" prize- if it were there, would be the components of the Futurama dioramas. I don't know, I have my doubts.....I think some of the model trucks have already turned up on eBay haven't they?

On the Avenue of Progress, the overhead illuminated exhibit boards that were above the concept cars- it wouldn't surprise me if THOSE are down there (totally smashed of course); but not the cars themselves.

I would love to dig up that AC Delco "future repair operator" capsule.

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If I had to wager on it, I'd bet the fiberglass chairs from the ride are not down there. The mechanical guts of the ride? Maybe....

The biggest "dig" prize- if it were there, would be the components of the Futurama dioramas. I don't know, I have my doubts.....I think some of the model trucks have already turned up on eBay haven't they?

On the Avenue of Progress, the overhead illuminated exhibit boards that were above the concept cars- it wouldn't surprise me if THOSE are down there (totally smashed of course); but not the cars themselves.

I would love to dig up that AC Delco "future repair operator" capsule.

Randy this sounds better and better.I will bring the shovels hard hats and lights,bring the cooler with some budlight .Set the date

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If anyone out there can do an overlay showing the GM pavilion and then an overlay of the track that would be great.

This is a call for help for all the talented PTU members.Great idea Randy.

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That's a great sheet, Tony, thanks for posting.

"228 Railroad Headlamps" (38 spaces x 6) on the entrance canopy?

Wow... talk about using off-the-shelf parts!

Mr. Treadway... a closeup, please.

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If anyone out there can do an overlay showing the GM pavilion and then an overlay of the track that would be great.

Hi Tony- Someone here actually did do that overlay last year when we discovered that the ride passed behind the windows in the GM facade. I can't recall if it were the entire ride or just the window section. In any case, if someone wants to provide me with an overhead shot and a side shot, I will be happy to overlay the track plan on it. My picture files have grown so vast I really don't have time to search for the images at this moment, maybe later on tonight if nobody else put them up yet. JS

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That's a great sheet, Tony, thanks for posting.

"228 Railroad Headlamps" (38 spaces x 6) on the entrance canopy?

Wow... talk about using off-the-shelf parts!

Mr. Treadway... a closeup, please.

The railroad headlamps were mounted in the top of "pods" which were hung over the entrance, at the bottom of the facade spars. So the lamps themselves weren't visible to most fairgoers with cameras. I do have a couple of photos that show them though.

I also have a photo that shows how the big GM logo was attached to the facade. As Maxwell Smart would say, "would you believe a thousand toothpicks Chief?"

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That's a great sheet, Tony, thanks for posting.

"228 Railroad Headlamps" (38 spaces x 6) on the entrance canopy?

Wow... talk about using off-the-shelf parts!

Mr. Treadway... a closeup, please.

NO problem.The documents GM gave me on the pavilion is just amazing.

it goes into such detail on how much wood, cement, nut,bolts even the landscaping on trees and plants.and I think I have to read again I think it said something about the 1939 worlds fair GM pavilion how they used some trees from that pavilion and replanted them at the 64 fair.Like I said I have to read again and if im correct I will post that document.

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Hi Tony- Someone here actually did do that overlay last year when we discovered that the ride passed behind the windows in the GM facade. I can't recall if it were the entire ride or just the window section. In any case, if someone wants to provide me with an overhead shot and a side shot, I will be happy to overlay the track plan on it. My picture files have grown so vast I really don't have time to search for the images at this moment, maybe later on tonight if nobody else put them up yet. JS

That would be great. I hope someone comes through with some photos for you.

Thanks

Tony

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This is the kind of overlay I was talking about, although this is just a rough sketch- I'm guessing- I don't have any reference material to go by to align things correctly. (And I'm not much of an artist either...)

GM_overlay.jpg

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This construction photo reveals a lot, including the basement.

086-025_-_General_Motors_under_construction.jpg

┬ęBill Cotter, Set 86, Picture #025

Turner Construction Company is still in business. Which one of you east coasters wants to check their archives for GM Pavilion blueprints?

<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.turnerconstruction.com/corporate/content.asp?d=5749">http://www.turnerconstruction.com/corpo ... asp?d=5749</a><!-- m -->

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What's confusing me now is if the Avenue of progress and displays were at street level, and the track was also at street level (the gray areas) in that area, then the ride would be traveling through the Ave of progress!

post-54-1206305317_thumb.jpggm79.jpg[/attachment:1qy3xq5h]Here is the overlay Kevin posted last year from the window discussion. (thanks for the link, K!)

GMRide.jpg[/attachment:1qy3xq5h]

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What's confusing me now is if the Avenue of progress and displays were at street level, and the track was also at street level (the gray areas) in that area, then the ride would be traveling through the Ave of progress!

post-54-1206305317_thumb.jpggm79.jpg[/attachment:2p9p32sv]Here is the overlay Kevin posted last year from the window discussion. (thanks for the link, K!)

GMRide.jpg[/attachment:2p9p32sv]

Good question. Then what was the track in the basement for?

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The Avenue of Progress was on the top floor, and led directly (at the same level) into the Upper Product Plaza. In Kevin's overlay you're looking down from the top through all three floors.

Based on the shading of the track sections on the top track sketch, this is what I think a map of the "top floor" would have looked like.

You have to remember that the Futurama track dove down and climbed back through three floors- starting at the top floor and going down to the basement. There were significant stretches of track in both the basement and the "middle" street-level floor, and only the loading & uploading (with speedramps) on the top floor. Hope this helps....

The cloudy gray area I put in because it isn't in any of the maps, but it would make sense that visitors would have to be able to walk from the "up" escalator to the boarding speedramp. (confirmed by a photo or two). Why NOT walk on clouds? <!-- s:-D --><!-- s:-D -->

I also think the large black area at the bottom of this drawing was occupied by administrative offices and perhaps a VIP lounge. There are windows on the outside of the building there, in exterior photos.

GM-top_floor.jpg

Photo #1- Loading area. this photo has always confused my as to why some people seem to be leaving and other people are ready to go, on the same speedramp, but this commercial slide is identified as the 'start' of the Futurama ride. The people back in the far shadows on the left are walking on the "clouds" on my map.

GM-top_floor-photo_1.jpg

Photo #2 - Unloading area. Clearly this one matches the map.

GM-top_floor-photo_2.jpg

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Tony01,

Would you be able to tell me who you contacted at Turner and which of their many offices you contacted?

I'd be happy to stop by their Hudson St office in NYC next week and see what they have in the way of archives but don't want to give PTU a bad name by bothering the same person with the same request.

In fact, when it comes to Futurama, I'll offer to take out the guy's sister if that's what it takes to get info. (Or NOT take her out. Whichever works.)

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Tony01,

Would you be able to tell me who you contacted at Turner and which of their many offices you contacted?

I'd be happy to stop by their Hudson St office in NYC next week and see what they have in the way of archives but don't want to give PTU a bad name by bothering the same person with the same request.

In fact, when it comes to Futurama, I'll offer to take out the guy's sister if that's what it takes to get info. (Or NOT take her out. Whichever works.)

Yes I would be happy to give you this information.When I called they dinot give me a contact person so I put attn archive dept.when I get a responce I will let you know.I was also told to go to the NY PUBLIC LIBARY located on 5thave and 42nd street in manhattan.They may have the blueprints to the pavilion if Turner cannot help with them.If they have them they would be avail to the public.Hey you maybe lucky to take a sexy librian out to lunch

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The Avenue of Progress was on the top floor, and led directly (at the same level) into the Upper Product Plaza. In Kevin's overlay you're looking down from the top through all three floors.

Based on the shading of the track sections on the top track sketch, this is what I think a map of the "top floor" would have looked like.

You have to remember that the Futurama track dove down and climbed back through three floors- starting at the top floor and going down to the basement. There were significant stretches of track in both the basement and the "middle" street-level floor, and only the loading & uploading (with speedramps) on the top floor. Hope this helps....

The cloudy gray area I put in because it isn't in any of the maps, but it would make sense that visitors would have to be able to walk from the "up" escalator to the boarding speedramp. (confirmed by a photo or two). Why NOT walk on clouds? <!-- s:-D --><!-- s:-D -->

I also think the large black area at the bottom of this drawing was occupied by administrative offices and perhaps a VIP lounge. There are windows on the outside of the building there, in exterior photos.

GM-top_floor.jpg

Photo #1- Loading area. this photo has always confused my as to why some people seem to be leaving and other people are ready to go, on the same speedramp, but this commercial slide is identified as the 'start' of the Futurama ride. The people back in the far shadows on the left are walking on the "clouds" on my map.

GM-top_floor-photo_1.jpg

Photo #2 - Unloading area. Clearly this one matches the map.

GM-top_floor-photo_2.jpg

Hi Randy

from the documents GM sent me yes you hit right on the nose .There were offices and adm. rooms in the building I have different room #s and telephone #s to each room.Also to go back to a photo I posted the 3 level building with the cylinder on the side which we were trying to see what the building was. Gm got back to me and stated again that was part of the building being demolished. It does shown the 3 floors but what is the cylinder in the photo.also in the documents it mention 8 stairways in the building were they behind the scene because all I see are escalators.

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It SHOULD be possible to map the approximate positions of the Futurama II dioramas, given the limited ride sketches we have, Ray's audio recordings (assuming the chairs moved at a constant speed, which the engineering report said was typically 1.4 mph), and still photographs.

We know the sequence of the dioramas, and I think the photos can tell us which side of the track the diorama was located on (film footage on Youtube helps too).

1. Moon- right side of the track

2. Antarctica- penguins & snow on the right side, but control room on the left???

3. Ocean- right side

4. Jungle- right side

5. Desert- left side

6. City of Tomorrow- right side

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I will post the speed of the ride when I get home this eve. I have that information in the documents.

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this photo has always confused my as to why some people seem to be leaving and other people are ready to go, on the same speedramp, but this commercial slide is identified as the 'start' of the Futurama ride.

In the official ride "script", the narrator said this at the end of the ride:

"Although many of you may wish to ride around again, it is not possible to do so at this time. Every seat for the next Futurama ride is taken and we must all leave our chairs as soon as we reach the unloading platform."

Since that is a commercial slide, maybe it was totally staged with some people getting up to leave and others starting the ride- something that would not have happened in everyday use, short of a malfunction at the unloading speedramp area.

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I'm voting for Antarctic weather forecast room being on the right.

I distinctly recall smartassing the guard standing on the left by rubbing my hands against my arms and asking, Aren't you cold? But that could have been anywhere in the Antarctic scenes.

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I will post the speed of the ride when I get home this eve. I have that information in the documents.

Adjustable by the master controller, with a max of 1.5 mph, and typical operation was set at 1.4 mph.

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