Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
magikbilly

Anyone seen these before?

Recommended Posts

Hi All,

There is a multi lot listing of 1939 Fair photographs - all large and glossy I think. I have seen these before and by the same seller I think...especially the Wonderbread which I recall because you don't see it often and there is a woman in the front I remember. Anyone have any experience with this seller or these images? It's a bunch of photographs - you won't miss it. Awesome subjects....but reprints?

MB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

At lease 1 member in here is bidding on this stuff. Anyone buy from them before? What did you receive? An "original" or an older reprint? I have seen these images by Iconpix before, and not just in their past auctions. I know I recall that Wonderbread. Some are published in books - not unique. The one showing the Carrier Igloo at night can be seen in "The New York World's Fair in 155 Photographs" for example. Has anyone bought from them??

MB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I’ve bought from ICONPIX before and had a good experience. My NYWF Halloween photos came from them and they were solid semi-professional shots. All removed from a scrapbook and of period. The snow covered fair grounds I got out bid on is definitely a press photo, not terribly uncommon. I have an original un-cropped version of this image that I got from a newspaper archive. Still some of what they offer is unique.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks Molasses!! I don't know what to do now...I'll perhaps bid on one or two - but having seen so many of them before...for sale by them...and many are trimmed to 7 1/2 x 9 1/2 but "not wire photos" - many who collect original vintage first strike doubleweight Hollywood stills might see a red flag there. I think I'll stick mostly to unpublished private candid contact prints - they are literally unique.

Photographic prints are a very dangerous area to collect in if you are going after originals - I think one of those idiotic Collectors Universe grading services (or the like; can you say RIPOFF?) is now 'grading" photographs as originals, restrikes, reprints from internegs etc..for autographed photographs whose certs/loa's/coa's were possibly "signed" by someone who may have never even seen the item! Of course, in true American fashion, the certs/loa's/coa's bear....stamped signatures! PCGS - not Hall anymore. PSA/DNA? Not Spence and Grad anymore...Hmmm.....BBB grade and report on PSA/DNA? "F - We strongly question the company’s reliability for reasons such as that they have failed to respond to complaints, their advertising is grossly misleading, they are not in compliance with the law’s licensing or registration requirements, their complaints contain especially serious allegations, or the company’s industry is known for its fraudulent business practices."

Ouch. Was it Spence or Grad who "authenticated' a baseball on live TV only to be told it was signed the night before buy a guy in the art department? LOL

"When a Fox-television news affiliate in Philadelphia asked him to verify the signatures on six baseballs signed by sports greats, he gave a firm thumbs-up to one apparently signed by former Phillies third-baseman Mike Schmidt. "Very, very typical of the way he would sign," he told the station's reporter. "Good speed, good letter formation, and reflects authority and spontaneity." Informed that the station's resident graphic artist had forged Schmidt's signature the day before, Spence could only reply: "He did a fine job."" - BARRONS

PS - Pardon the rant - a long winded way of saying "be careful out there!" I won some iconpix and I can't wait to see them I expect to be pleased as I won doubleweight sepia prints that should be fine. Some of those cool b/w 8x10's or trimmed 8x10 "not wire photos" that have been published in books and, I believe postcards, make me nervous though. I am still wondering how they are able to sell multiple vintage prints of that Wonderbread photo ending Monday night...

Best,

MB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

MB, Did you get your pictures & did they meet expectations?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

"Granted, they're no Magikbilly pix... but pretty cool, nonetheless." - Amen to that. And thanks.

Well, are they vintage? How you do you define vintage...

To answer your question: NO. Not to me in my humble opinion. All the cool b/w I got are reprints from the 1950's or later perhaps, as expected from the scans Same exact stuff I encounter with most everyone selling "original" movie still from the 1940's-50's. Most have no clue. There is a vast difference. Paper, color, emulsion, age tone, trimming tricks etc.. And there were staple holes in the reprints. I will trust my eye as I should from now on. I spent 3x + as much for reprints from that stupid auction - the truly original item was $9 with the single bidder - me. People chasing subjects and not originals.

MB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Exactly right MB for most Ebayers it’s subject over originals. I kind of flip flop depending on what it is. Sorry it didn’t turn out for you. My experience with them was good, like anything it’s a gamble, sometimes you need to listen to your gut. Still the hunt is a lot of fun!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi Molasses,

Yes - but it was not really a hunt for me - I knew what these would be - I took a stupid chance instead of trusting myself I recognized several and others are in books. At least I got some originals! One day I will do a photo-essay showing what there is to show re photographic prints and reprints, copy prints etc..

I have an original mint condition 7x9 1939 matte double weight rather killer Perisphere photo up for $39.95 for months and no one bites....beats me. Only "problem" is the linen hinge on the reverse from original proper framing.

MB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just bought eleven photos of "my" beloved amusement park. The photos were taken after the gates had closed for the last time, with all the buildings/rides still ready for the crowds. In just a few weeks the rides would be sold off. The buildings would suffer the first of several fires.

The whole auction was a bit weird, and I'm not sure it was all legit bidding.

Although the third highest bidder I got a "second chance" offer. I took it. I got repros.

The photos were scans, photo shopped from the originals (with none of the talent of Randy or Bill). The backing paper screaming at me "new".

I'm keeping them, but feel cheated a bit.

I'm going to keep my eyes far more open, and ask many more questions, in the next photo auction I enter in.

I feel terrible for your experience Billy, and I write all this to share a wee bit of your pain. I write it, too, to encourage you to share your knowledge on photos. I know I have a good deal to learn in photo auctions.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hiya Rose,

Thanks. Too bad that happened. I hope you did not pay too much! It is indeed a tough thing - I have bought movie stills from a top notch NY dealer who is very well known and have received restrikes here and there. It is not easy to tell for some but I find it hard to believe they are all honest mistakes. Handle enough of anything and you will start to notice patterns. When I have time, after I finish writing this huge thing I am working on, or if I get a free evening, I will write out and show what I have learnedw tih words and scans. A lot has to do with clarity, borders, colors, paper, stamps, marks...and with movie tills negative numbers and location, sharpness..a lot of stuff, but much easier to get a feel for than grading coins, which can take years and sometimes very expensive mistakes unless one is very careful. Just sticking to Mint State slabbed coins at decent prices, which one might think is reasonable, is suicidal without knowing what makes a MS64 a MS65 and where, when etc...(and in which series and year from which mint etc.... )...there is less wiggle room with movie stills thankfully!

In a nutshell (of movie stills)- the heavier, sharper, warmer in tone, more even the borders and yellower (aged and worn correclty) it is the more likely it is original. Studio stamps, details and marks from period reproduction sucxh for newspapers or pinholes from original use or secondary use (sometimes lovely tiny little rusty holes) all help as does the nature of the paper fibre on the reverse and the sheen of the gloss (or matte as in the color dot matrix printed still typical of the 1970's) on the front.

With other photographs, the more wonderful the subject, as in your case, the more likely it is not original. This is the easiest rule to state here. It is not unbendable at all - this is where the fun comes in. I once purchased a photograph taken onboard the R.M.S. Olympic, sister to Titanic, for 25 cents out of a box of "junk".

MB

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for offering to look for photos of the park, Bill. I very much appreciate it. I would, most certainly, be interested in any that might pop up in your collection of vintage photos.

The place was a small regional amusement area called Lincoln Park. It was located on the border of Fall River, MA and N. Dartmouth, MA. (Sometimes it's also listed as "outside New Bedford, MA") It started, as so many amusement parks did, as a trolley destination. It grew, to include a very popular ballroom, roller skating rink, bowling alley, and (for the time) "modern" amusement rides. There was the "pavillion" where "world famous" clam cakes and chowder were massively consumed, and a small stage which hosted all sorts of acts.

During the thirties and forties some big bands came through, and people as far away as Boston (which in those days seemed a considerable distance) would come to ride the rides, and dance into the evening.

Lincoln Park was a popular destination from many parts of New England right into the late seventies and early eighties. Then, facing the ever expanding six flags type parks, and Disney world, it began to fade. A change in ownership (and vision) also crippled it. By the mid eighties, it closed. It seemed to take only weeks for fires to break out in the abandoned dark rides and pavilions. The old wooden coaster (the comet) held on until two years ago, when after a blizzard, it caved into white washed timber.

I collect anything from the park. It being nothing but good memories for me. My grandmother (Nanny, for those who may remember my stories of her. She visited the 64/65 fair.) took me, at least, twice a year, every year of my childhood. My mother would take me now and then, and other children's parents, girl scout trips, and even school crossing guard trips, would make up other chances to ride the rides, eat great food, and watch a show.

I loved that park. Many people did. I think it's memory still brings a smile to others faces. I know that items with the park name or image tend to spur on bidding wars. There are not many items from the park, but, what is out there seems coveted.

Unlike it's cousins Canobie Lake Park and Rocky Point Park: I'm not aware of Lincoln Park having any fair legacies. (Rocky point being, once, a home of one of the communication arch's.)

I'm apologize for testing your tolerance with my lengthiness. My passion for this place is deep.

Thank you very much for your tips, Billy.

I know these photos are copies, it's pretty darn obvious. Yet they are photos of the park, and I wouldn't have them otherwise. I didn't pay too much for them, thankfully.

I'll tell myself that the gentleman (who had 100 percent positive feedback) meant well, maybe scanning the originals and touching them up to sell a "better" copy, or making copies to accommodate everyone in on the bidding.

In any case: the tips are good ones and I'm thankful for them. I'm also thankful for your kindness, Bill, and everyone's tolerance in reading this.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

There is a certain magic to the small family owned parks that these, for lack of a better phrase, “chain parks” are eluded by. Yet another piece of Americana fading away.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing here on Lincoln Park, Rose, but I will keep an eye out for you. Like you, I have fond memories of some of these small parks. I used to enjoy Bertrand's Island at Lake Hopatcong, NJ. Sadly gone as well.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you Bill. I appreciate that.

I have a great love of the small parks, too. In so many ways their size and simplicity allowed for an intimacy that just can't be duplicated now. One could absorb them, their experience, and they still retained their wonder.

I really miss Lincoln park, and (although to a lessor degree) Rocky Point, Crescent Park, and the many other small amusement areas that I grew up with. I know how you must feel about Betrands Island, Bill.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×